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Roberto,

Can you please alter the Section you added: " How can the Gospel in muslim view be called Injil (Evangelia is Greek for Good News) ??" As it is, its a very short section, and doesn't really make much sense to have the content in the title like that. Can you please change the title to something like "What was Isa's Good News?" and then go on and talk about the meaning of Injil, Evangelia (sp?) and What Isa's good news message was? All of that stuff. Put in the content under the heading (if you know what I mean?

I do not have the knowledge required to write that section myself; so I'm leaving it to you if you don't mind? It does not have enough imformation at present to warrant its own subheading so may have to be deleted if you don't pad it out.

Thanks

Sanitarium 21:18, 4 May 2007 (PDT)

I tried. Discussion about this I had also tried on ffi-forum : http://www.faithfreedom.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=39214 Robertto 00:14, 6 May 2007 (PDT)

Hey Roberto, Good job! If you don't mind I may polish it up a bit later? Can you add the bit about "What was Isa's "Good News" then? ie. if he was simply confirming the messages of the previous prophets. I think that is an integral point from your original article! Thanks so much for all your hard work here at Wiki Islam; you have got some good stuff and raised some good points!

keep up the great work! Sanitarium 00:20, 6 May 2007 (PDT)

[edit] Islam's opinion on Injil

I like this discussion about the Injeel. It is good that someone has thought of raising the issue and having it thrashed out in the open.

The Coran does claim that God revealed His Message to mankind at large, in different stages ,in instalments so to speak. But the first books and revelations that came before the Coran were all tampered with and manipulated by different groups of interest with the rebellious Jews(who killed their own prophets and so much angered Moses that he broke the tables) always leading the show as they continue to do today. There is no denying that the Torah has been disfigured (the Old Testament tells us so) and there is no denying too, that the Injeel was doctored time and again, otherwise we should have only on version of it today rather than so many which often contradict each other.In fact the Injeel continues to this day to be (adapted) from time to time to meet the interests and inclinations of eminently notorious pressure groups that include mainly, but not only, Jewish overlords.

The Coran recognizes these historical facts and simply asserts that it is there to set the record straight regarding the Message of God brought down to humanity through all the earlier prophets.

It is good that we admit that Islam has a point here. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ibrawa (talk • contribs). ( How to sign your posts. ?)

I do not understand your point. Are you saying there is evidence that the previous scriptures have been corrupted? Where is this evidence? In fact, WHERE does the Quran make the claim that the previous scriptures are PHYSICALLY corrupted? Please elaborate. Sanitarium 06:07, 24 June 2007 (PDT)

Hello, Sanitarium, It is good of you to have asked for more clarifications on this matter of the Coran's view of the Injeel and te Torah. A.Here is a quote from the Coran to this effect. Surah IV Verse 46: 46. Of the Jews there are those who displace words from their right places , And say: "We hear and we disobey" 47. O ye People of the Book! Believe in what We have now revealed, confirming what was already with you B. The Old testament tells us in more then one place that the Jews manipulated the Word of God and disobeyed Him. C. As for the Injeel, don't you agree that, had it not been tampered with all along the past and present times, we would normally have just one and only one version of it, rather than so many disparate ones? So you see, I believe, at least here, the Coran does have a point. Regards

Thanks for our clarification! However, I have not seen ANY place in the entire Quran that says that the Physical scriptures have been corrupted! Yes, it says that the Jews 'changed the words' from their places; hwoever the Quran makes it clear that they did this with their mouths/tongues. This means that they changed the oral recitations to that which was not in their Torah. Nowhere does it say the scriptures are physically corrupted. What do you think?

Please see my article on Quran 2:79 as it lists most of the verses.

Thanks Sanitarium 06:48, 24 June 2007 (PDT)

Dear Sanitarium,

I undeerstand your quest for the truth regarding this matter.But let me just humbly argue as follows:

  A. Today we have to admit that we have no ORIGINAL TORAH nor any ORIGINAL GOSPEL.
     The Tablets were destroyed by Moses himself, and the first attempt at recording the 
     Gospel was made about a hundred and sixty years after the death of Christ. The 
     frailty of human memory ( combined with intentional  and self-serving changes 
     introuced by some individuals or pressure groups) has led, alas, to us having more than
     one ( at times conflicting)versions of the Bible today.
     This seems, to me, to be sufficient corroboration of the Coran's view that both the Torah 
     and the Gospel have been subjected to some doctoring over the many  past centuries since
     their revelation.

  B. The Coran holds both the Torah and the Injeel in high esteem and would not have 
     unjustifiably cast any doubt about the authenticity of the texts circulating then as a 
     reproduction of them.(Remember they were only manuscripts that were often at variance
     with each other).

So, you see, dear Sanitarium, it would only be fair to admit here that Islam does have a point here. Regards, —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Ibrawa (talk • contribs). ( How to sign your posts. ?)

Hello Ibrawa,

Are you saying that Musa destroyed the Torah as written on stone tablets? Can you please read this story in your bible? You are referring to the Ten Commandments which were on stone, and destroyed by Musa. However, Musa went back up the mountain and got another copy from God (as goes the story) There is no evidence that:

(a)The Quran says the previous scriptures are physically corrupt (b The "previous scriptures" are any different today than the copies before Muhammad's Day (c) Even if they WERE corrupt (no evidence for this) that the originals reflected anything like the Quran.

I think you need to come to Faith Freedom Forum (link given by Whale before let me know if you want it again) because you have YET to show (nor has any Muslim to date) that the Quran claims the previous scriptures are physically corrupt.

Thanks Sanitarium 09:22, 24 June 2007 (PDT)